Legality of withholding funds?

[Oninja79]

Hi

 

I recently joined Bgo casino, deposited £50 and played slots for a few hours. I then suddenly found my account locked. It transpired that I had unwittingly opened a duplicate account. Apparently I self-excluded from their site some time ago. I do not recollect doing this but I don't dispute that it happened. I understand that this is a breach of the terms and conditions and I accept that they will not allow me to play on their site. I am of the belief however that given I was playing with no possible way of winning they should refund my deposit of £50, please note I did not lose this money in the time I was allowed to play before the account beIng locked. At this point my balance was approx £130. So this isn't sour grapes. Bgo are refusing to refund the deposit.

 

My argument is that I deposited money with them for them to provide me with a service, a service that they would not provide. In any other situation where a customer pays for something and a vendor cannot fulfil the order, a refund is due. If I ordered something from Amazon and they couldn't fulfil the order, they wouldn't email me to say they don't have the item AND they were keeping my money, they would give a refund.

 

Bgo are stating that they are confiscating the funds to protect me and are doing so in line with Gambling Commission guidelines. I cannot get my head around this being legal. It seems to me that on the face of it this is simply a way for a casino to unscrupulously line their pockets, terms and conditions this and guidelines that. How is it legal?

 

It's not really about they money, I've requested that if they won't refund me they give the £50 charity, I just don't see why Bgo should pocket money that I don't believe is rightly theirs.

 

Has anyone else been in a similar situation?

[Fiekie247]

Hi

 

I recently joined Bgo casino, deposited £50 and played slots for a few hours. I then suddenly found my account locked. It transpired that I had unwittingly opened a duplicate account. Apparently I self-excluded from their site some time ago. I do not recollect doing this but I don't dispute that it happened. I understand that this is a breach of the terms and conditions and I accept that they will not allow me to play on their site. I am of the belief however that given I was playing with no possible way of winning they should refund my deposit of £50, please note I did not lose this money in the time I was allowed to play before the account beIng locked. At this point my balance was approx £130. So this isn't sour grapes. Bgo are refusing to refund the deposit.

 

My argument is that I deposited money with them for them to provide me with a service, a service that they would not provide. In any other situation where a customer pays for something and a vendor cannot fulfil the order, a refund is due. If I ordered something from Amazon and they couldn't fulfil the order, they wouldn't email me to say they don't have the item AND they were keeping my money, they would give a refund.

 

Bgo are stating that they are confiscating the funds to protect me and are doing so in line with Gambling Commission guidelines. I cannot get my head around this being legal. It seems to me that on the face of it this is simply a way for a casino to unscrupulously line their pockets, terms and conditions this and guidelines that. How is it legal?

 

It's not really about they money, I've requested that if they won't refund me they give the £50 charity, I just don't see why Bgo should pocket money that I don't believe is rightly theirs.

 

Has anyone else been in a similar situation?

Similar Situation, NO... - The only situation most of us come across is if we breached the bonus rules terms, like exceed the max during bonus play etc. - Funds get confiscated but deposit return most times as a gesture of goodwill by the casinos.

 

Regarding your situation only our Guru - AKA Valdes will be able to provide you with a straight answer as i honestly do not know.

 

Give some time he will respond.

[raverbabe]

I would say most quality casinos would refund this deposit without even being asked to. Have BGO provided a reason why do not intend to refund this money?

[Oninja79]

Similar Situation, NO... - The only situation most of us come across is if we breached the bonus rules terms, like exceed the max during bonus play etc. - Funds get confiscated but deposit return most times as a gesture of goodwill by the casinos.

 

Regarding your situation only our Guru - AKA Valdes will be able to provide you with a straight answer as i honestly do not know.

 

Give some time he will respond.

Thanks for the response, I will await Valdes' input.

[Oninja79]

I would say most quality casinos would refund this deposit without even being asked to. Have BGO provided a reason why do not intend to refund this money?

In one on my emails to them I stated that I was amazed that I was even having to request the refund and that they weren't doing it automatically.

 

They seem to be hiding behind Gambling Commission "guidelines", I asked them if these guidelines were legally binding to which they didn't respond. In fact they have not answered a single question in any of my emails. The customer service has been atrocious, I think Paris Hilton has a new role there.

[ValDes]

Hi

 

I recently joined Bgo casino, deposited £50 and played slots for a few hours. I then suddenly found my account locked. It transpired that I had unwittingly opened a duplicate account. Apparently I self-excluded from their site some time ago. I do not recollect doing this but I don't dispute that it happened. I understand that this is a breach of the terms and conditions and I accept that they will not allow me to play on their site. I am of the belief however that given I was playing with no possible way of winning they should refund my deposit of £50, please note I did not lose this money in the time I was allowed to play before the account beIng locked. At this point my balance was approx £130. So this isn't sour grapes. Bgo are refusing to refund the deposit.

 

My argument is that I deposited money with them for them to provide me with a service, a service that they would not provide. In any other situation where a customer pays for something and a vendor cannot fulfil the order, a refund is due. If I ordered something from Amazon and they couldn't fulfil the order, they wouldn't email me to say they don't have the item AND they were keeping my money, they would give a refund.

 

Bgo are stating that they are confiscating the funds to protect me and are doing so in line with Gambling Commission guidelines. I cannot get my head around this being legal. It seems to me that on the face of it this is simply a way for a casino to unscrupulously line their pockets, terms and conditions this and guidelines that. How is it legal?

 

It's not really about they money, I've requested that if they won't refund me they give the £50 charity, I just don't see why Bgo should pocket money that I don't believe is rightly theirs.

 

Has anyone else been in a similar situation?

 

Hi there Oninja79 and welcome to AskGamblers. 

 

Please make sure to go over the guidance approved and conducted by the United Kingdom Gambling Commission in regards of Responsible Gaming policies and procedures which all approved licensees must follow, BGO including. 

 

http://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/FAQs/Problem-gambling/Problem-gambling.aspx

 

It seems your case fits perfectly to the situation described in this particular article:

 

http://www.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/FAQs/Problem-gambling/Can-I-get-my-money-back.aspx

 

Feel free to forward all your questions and thoughts regarding the fairness  of what's written there in front of the UKGC directly. 

[MacdoniS]

Hi

 

I recently joined Bgo casino, deposited £50 and played slots for a few hours. I then suddenly found my account locked. It transpired that I had unwittingly opened a duplicate account. Apparently I self-excluded from their site some time ago. I do not recollect doing this but I don't dispute that it happened. I understand that this is a breach of the terms and conditions and I accept that they will not allow me to play on their site. I am of the belief however that given I was playing with no possible way of winning they should refund my deposit of £50, please note I did not lose this money in the time I was allowed to play before the account beIng locked. At this point my balance was approx £130. So this isn't sour grapes. Bgo are refusing to refund the deposit.

 

My argument is that I deposited money with them for them to provide me with a service, a service that they would not provide. In any other situation where a customer pays for something and a vendor cannot fulfil the order, a refund is due. If I ordered something from Amazon and they couldn't fulfil the order, they wouldn't email me to say they don't have the item AND they were keeping my money, they would give a refund.

 

Bgo are stating that they are confiscating the funds to protect me and are doing so in line with Gambling Commission guidelines. I cannot get my head around this being legal. It seems to me that on the face of it this is simply a way for a casino to unscrupulously line their pockets, terms and conditions this and guidelines that. How is it legal?

 

It's not really about they money, I've requested that if they won't refund me they give the £50 charity, I just don't see why Bgo should pocket money that I don't believe is rightly theirs.

 

 

Hi

 

I recently joined Bgo casino, deposited £50 and played slots for a few hours. I then suddenly found my account locked. It transpired that I had unwittingly opened a duplicate account. Apparently I self-excluded from their site some time ago. I do not recollect doing this but I don't dispute that it happened. I understand that this is a breach of the terms and conditions and I accept that they will not allow me to play on their site. I am of the belief however that given I was playing with no possible way of winning they should refund my deposit of £50, please note I did not lose this money in the time I was allowed to play before the account beIng locked. At this point my balance was approx £130. So this isn't sour grapes. Bgo are refusing to refund the deposit.

 

My argument is that I deposited money with them for them to provide me with a service, a service that they would not provide. In any other situation where a customer pays for something and a vendor cannot fulfil the order, a refund is due. If I ordered something from Amazon and they couldn't fulfil the order, they wouldn't email me to say they don't have the item AND they were keeping my money, they would give a refund.

 

Bgo are stating that they are confiscating the funds to protect me and are doing so in line with Gambling Commission guidelines. I cannot get my head around this being legal. It seems to me that on the face of it this is simply a way for a casino to unscrupulously line their pockets, terms and conditions this and guidelines that. How is it legal?

 

It's not really about they money, I've requested that if they won't refund me they give the £50 charity, I just don't see why Bgo should pocket money that I don't believe is rightly theirs.

 

Has anyone else been in a similar situation?

 

Has anyone else been in a similar situation?

From my perspective and experience, there's a higher chance that you will get your refund if you will make a complaint case to the BGO casino but expect it to be time consuming mate. Iv'e seen your case before, he/she got the refund but it takes time when he/she got it good luck! 

[Oninja79]

Hi Valdes

 

Thanks very much for the reply and the helpful link. I think what is frustrating is that there seems to be this misplaced belief on behalf of the casino and the Gambling Commission that anyone who self-excludes is a problem gambler. People self-exclude any number of reasons but they don't appear to recognise that.

[Oninja79]

From my perspective and experience, there's a higher chance that you will get your refund if you will make a complaint case to the BGO casino but expect it to be time consuming mate. Iv'e seen your case before, he/she got the refund but it takes time when he/she got it good luck!

Thanks for your input. I am going to escalate this but I don't think I will get my money back.

 

Bgo haven't bothered to respond to my email where I stated that if they gave the money to charity I would end my dispute. I think is quite disappointing when a well-known casino would rather argue a case like this than just hand over £50 to a charity.

[raverbabe]

The UKGC requests that all casinos perform due diligence to ensure they are not accepting deposits or bets from players who have previously self excluded. I don't know of any rule they have which states that casinos are allowed to keep any monies they take as a result of failing to prevent a self excluded player from making deposits and/or bets! 

 

I wouldn't accept this, they have no right to keep your money which is why I was asking if they have given you any reasoning or justification for having done so. Assuming you have done nothing wrong other than accidentally opened a duplicate account then you absolutely deserve your money back and you shouldn't rest until you get it.

[MacdoniS]

Thanks for your input. I am going to escalate this but I don't think I will get my money back.

 

Bgo haven't bothered to respond to my email where I stated that if they gave the money to charity I would end my dispute. I think is quite disappointing when a well-known casino would rather argue a case like this than just hand over £50 to a charity.

 It's a lesson learned for you mate. Anyway, you will never know if you will not try. If they respond and you have an agreement then that will be great and many of the players here will have the opportunity to avoid that situation.. Updating them concerning to your dispute will not do harm. Good Luck Oninja79! 

[MacdoniS]

The UKGC requests that all casinos perform due diligence to ensure they are not accepting deposits or bets from players who have previously self excluded. I don't know of any rule they have which states that casinos are allowed to keep any monies they take as a result of failing to prevent a self excluded player from making deposits and/or bets! 

 

I wouldn't accept this, they have no right to keep your money which is why I was asking if they have given you any reasoning or justification for having done so. Assuming you have done nothing wrong other than accidentally opened a duplicate account then you absolutely deserve your money back and you shouldn't rest until you get it.

Yes, this is true. At first hand they must not accept the deposits and they must verified their customer to the fullest. This is a good dispute by the way, I don't know what will be the casinos sentence about this I hope they will have the consensus. 

[ValDes]

Hi Valdes

 

Thanks very much for the reply and the helpful link. I think what is frustrating is that there seems to be this misplaced belief on behalf of the casino and the Gambling Commission that anyone who self-excludes is a problem gambler. People self-exclude any number of reasons but they don't appear to recognise that.

 

Sorry, but couldn't disagree more. There is in fact a huge difference between closing your account due to problem gambling OR any other reason and that is why there are two procedures set in place from all respectful regulatory authorities. One is called Self-Exclusion /SE/ and it refers to problem gambling in 99,9999% of the time. The other one is what we all know as Account Closure /AC/ option and it refers to any other reason one would use to have their casino account blocked/closed such as not happy with casino support for example, or casino bonus policy etc etc... And that is why there is such a huge difference when it comes to SE and AC procedures, requirements and of course, all the consequences it brings once set in place. 

 

Strongly recommend you reading more about it using the links provided within my previous post. 

[ValDes]

The UKGC requests that all casinos perform due diligence to ensure they are not accepting deposits or bets from players who have previously self excluded. I don't know of any rule they have which states that casinos are allowed to keep any monies they take as a result of failing to prevent a self excluded player from making deposits and/or bets! 

 

I wouldn't accept this, they have no right to keep your money which is why I was asking if they have given you any reasoning or justification for having done so. Assuming you have done nothing wrong other than accidentally opened a duplicate account then you absolutely deserve your money back and you shouldn't rest until you get it.

 

Oh dear, I believe you are so wrong this time... 

 

Sincerely recommend you reading this particular section of the UKGC website. You will be surprised to find out that it is mostly player's own responsibility to due the aforementioned 'due diligence'... But wait to read this one quoted below, cannot wait to hear your reaction.

 

Can I get my money back if I gamble after I have self-excluded?

[raverbabe]

Well I guess a player does have to take some responsibility for the fact they managed to create another account at place they had previously excluded from. But surely that doesn't give them the right to confiscate deposits that haven't been lost? I'm pretty sure the UKGC text is referring to funds that have been deposited and lost isn't it?

[ValDes]

Well I guess a player does have to take some responsibility for the fact they managed to create another account at place they had previously excluded from. But surely that doesn't give them the right to confiscate deposits that haven't been lost? I'm pretty sure the UKGC text is referring to funds that have been deposited and lost isn't it?

 

Nope. I would say it refers to both situations when the deposit is lost and when the funds are still available. We had lots of complaints last year where casinos refused to refund deposits to players who had an active SE agreement with one of the brands within the group and opened an account with another brand within the same group citing the aforementioned guidelines issued by the United Kingdom Gambling Commission.  

[jessback]

Thanks for the info!