When is the Terms of Sevice of a casino Voidable?

[pinnit2015]

Quick point about conflict of interest declarations....they're generally limited/useless as a control against wrong doing. 

Fine, if you're an employee with no intention of doing malfeasance, managers don't want employees having their integrity questioned (and therefore go: you can't look at this because that's your brothers company so i'll give it to John instead etc), use by HR in disciplinary cases.

Years ago we were looking at a fraud and connections between people/companies: ah, there's CoI declarations, why wasn't that picked up? Because you'd have be be pretty thick to declare an interest and then engage in skullduggery (or, maybe genius: of course he wouldn't say that and do that: it's too obvious)

[Ghostnipple]

19 hours ago, Blackjax said:

@Ghostnipple what was your conflict with the casino where you broke terms or you think that casino was unfair to you?

Sir,  I notice you have made no attempt to clarify your statements regarding the structure of the  AGCCS team.
I have asked you twice already.  I'm not here to argue, I wish to be proven wrong and I'm inviting you do assist me in that. I'm looking for transparency and I'm look for details.
If neither exist I want to be sure about that. Because again where money is concerned both details and transparency matter. 

[Ghostnipple]

Well the discussion is enlightening, sometimes its not what is said that provides insight but how it is said that gives you your answer. As I have stated before the complaints process has value as it protects the single voice by being drowned out by those who have the gatekeeping access, the resources and  those who can martial the numbers to drown out that voice. Personally I support the process for that reason, but that doesn't mean it can't offer more value to the player than it currently does.

[Blackjax]

1 minute ago, Ghostnipple said:

Sir,  I notice you have made no attempt to clarify your statements regarding the structure of the  AGCCS team.
I have asked you twice already.  I'm not here to argue, I wish to be proven wrong and I'm inviting you do assist me in that. I'm looking for transparency and I'm look for details.

I have made it clear multiple times how the structure works within AGCCS, its your inability to not understand. Its called playing victim card. You know you broke casino terms and you are now beating around the bush to find loopholes in a system which is transparent. 

I would like to repeat myself. Please tell me what terms did you break because where money is concerned both details and transperency matter. 

[Ghostnipple]

1 minute ago, Blackjax said:

I have made it clear multiple times how the structure works within AGCCS, its your inability to not understand. Its called playing victim card. You know you broke casino terms and you are now beating around the bush to find loopholes in a system which is transparent. 

I would like to repeat myself. Please tell me what terms did you break because where money is concerned both details and transperency matter. 

 

Im sorry I dont understand what you are talking about.

[Blackjax]

2 minutes ago, Ghostnipple said:

Im sorry I dont understand what you are talking about.

To further assist you please tell me what terms did you break at the casino because where money is concerned both details and transperency matter. 

[Ghostnipple]

17 minutes ago, Blackjax said:

To further assist you please tell me what terms did you break at the casino because where money is concerned both details and transperency matter. 

It seems we agree, thank you for your support and for illustrating my point.

[Blackjax]

24 minutes ago, Ghostnipple said:

It seems we agree, thank you for your support and for illustrating my point.

Then why are you running away. Please elaborate on the terms broken by you and why are you refusing to cooperate with casinos on KYC matters?

[Ghostnipple]

On 3/10/2023 at 4:04 PM, Afi4wins said:

@Ghostnipple Are you referring to Askgamblers' AGCCS Team?

If so, then only an admin staff ( @cocopop3011 or @ValDes ) can give you an answer. We members do not know who the team are.

Sorry to go a long way about it. But do you see my point about the value of the complaints procedure over forum discussion? How it provides a level and fair platform for the player to make their arguments in a safe space and for those arguments to be judged on their merits against the casino's arguments.

It has long been standard practice insome casino's to use their own staffing resources to derail undesirable forum discussion, make personal attacks and otherwise attempt to drown out a player's voice. This is unlikely to happen in the complaints procedure. It is also why I believe complaints relating to Terms of Service deserve a similar platform, as casinos seek to move all complaints under the umbrella of ToS.

[Blackjax]

11 minutes ago, Ghostnipple said:

Sorry to go a long way about it. But do you see my point about the value of the complaints procedure over forum discussion? How it provides a level and fair platform for the player to make their arguments in a safe space and for those arguments to be judged on their merits against the casino's arguments.

It has long been standard practice insome casino's to use their own staffing resources to derail undesirable forum discussion, make personal attacks and otherwise attempt to drown out a player's voice. This is unlikely to happen in the complaints procedure. It is also why I believe complaints relating to Terms of Service deserve a similar platform, as casinos seek to move all complaints under the umbrella of ToS.

Why do you feel so? Why do you think the casino is always wrong and the player is always right?

Lets talk about your case and the reason why you are here. Our forum only has admin who belongs to AG and rest of us are independent forum members. 

Share with us your case we will talk about it and share our input. You are the person asking about AG's transparency without being transparent yourself. I have read your first post where you are saying why you should share your personal details in order to get money. Now you are saying everything needs to be transparent where money is involved. You are jumping both ways. That is not how discussions happen. Be transparent yourself and all of us here will guide you.

 

[Ghostnipple]

5 minutes ago, Blackjax said:

Why do you feel so? Why do you think the casino is always wrong and the player is always right?

Lets talk about your case and the reason why you are here. Our forum only has admin who belongs to AG and rest of us are independent forum members. 

Share with us your case we will talk about it and share our input. You are the person asking about AG's transparency without being transparent yourself. I have read your first post where you are saying why you should share your personal details in order to get money. Now you are saying everything needs to be transparent where money is involved. You are jumping both ways. That is not how discussions happen. Be transparent yourself and all of us here will guide you.

 

Apologies I have allocated 20 mins for forum discussion today, now I have other priorities. But rest assured your posts will get all the attention I believe they deserve. Its a nice sunny day here and I'm going to take the dog for a walk. You enjoy your day or evening  there.

[Ghostnipple]

18 hours ago, pinnit2015 said:

Quick point about conflict of interest declarations....they're generally limited/useless as a control against wrong doing. 

Fine, if you're an employee with no intention of doing malfeasance, managers don't want employees having their integrity questioned (and therefore go: you can't look at this because that's your brothers company so i'll give it to John instead etc), use by HR in disciplinary cases.

Years ago we were looking at a fraud and connections between people/companies: ah, there's CoI declarations, why wasn't that picked up? Because you'd have be be pretty thick to declare an interest and then engage in skullduggery (or, maybe genius: of course he wouldn't say that and do that: it's too obvious)

I agree with you there but sometimes I have to go a long way around to make a point, apologies for that.

[pinnit2015]

First and foremost, whilst you can't eliminate the risk you need to use a complaints process you can reduce the need by due diligence on both the casino and the terms ( and i do agree with you on the points of unenforceable terms possibly being rolled out)

Subject of ADR's v 'Informal' processes - i prefer the latter. I think it is more transparent than faceless ADR rulings. I also think, you get a good rep like Olle at Bitstarz you'll have a better chance of getting heard than a faceless ADR - bare in mind as well, where we can see the casino reply to complaints (on either a forum and/or a complaints process) it helps: true, the casino may be playing a PR exercise but it allows them to demonstrate they're not always the bad guy - players have a convenient tendency to leave out critical information.

 

[Ghostnipple]

41 minutes ago, pinnit2015 said:

First and foremost, whilst you can't eliminate the risk you need to use a complaints process you can reduce the need by due diligence on both the casino and the terms ( and i do agree with you on the points of unenforceable terms possibly being rolled out)

Subject of ADR's v 'Informal' processes - i prefer the latter. I think it is more transparent than faceless ADR rulings. I also think, you get a good rep like Olle at Bitstarz you'll have a better chance of getting heard than a faceless ADR - bare in mind as well, where we can see the casino reply to complaints (on either a forum and/or a complaints process) it helps: true, the casino may be playing a PR exercise but it allows them to demonstrate they're not always the bad guy - players have a convenient tendency to leave out critical information.

 

Yeah you see the thing is the casino's are facing an ever changing landscape and almost on a daily basis they have to adapt to political, economical, social, technological and legal issues. The sector is highly competitive and the ability to adapt quickly must be in their blood to survive. The complaints AGCC's process is something they are adapting too and the way they are doing it is by moving most if not all potential complaint's under the umbrella protection of their Terms of Service. AGCCS does not entertain complaints that fall under ToS. So what is going to happen is that the AGCCs is going to become less relevant over time unless it also adapts.

Part of the problem that is emerging as far as I can see is the inability to understand that someone can be both supportive and critical at the same time. However AGCCS can do what it wants. Personally I'm just trying to figure out is it worth my time.

[pinnit2015]

There will always be a forum for resolving complaints like here (and many other sites) - i can't see it becoming any less relevant than it has been up to this point.

Casino's care more about new sign ups than retaining players. Annoy a player, close their account? Who cares - we have 100 new sign ups today. 

A line needs to be drawn in the sand somewhere - hence the term emphasis. 

[pinnit2015]

And if you take a complaint to an ADR based on a blatant breach of a Term i doubt they'll much consider it either - the only place to rule on the fairness of them is in a court. 

[Blackjax]

27 minutes ago, pinnit2015 said:

And if you take a complaint to an ADR based on a blatant breach of a Term i doubt they'll much consider it either - the only place to rule on the fairness of them is in a court. 

Mr P Just for your information he has broken terms of a casino and accepts it but does not want to elaborate. Secondly I assume its a crypto casino and I believe its Stake casino. You still suggest going to court? Cryptos and Jurisdiction together are part of a bad love story as far as I know.

[pinnit2015]

If you think casino's are bad for breaking terms, try an insurance company with their requirements (and your non compliance) for a policy to be voided

Well over the years we've heard players with supposed legal teams behind them ('My Lawyer has been contacted'), yet they never go anywhere.  A suppose a Letter Before Action might help in the odd case but folk would only go the court route for large amounts i imagine. And there would be no point if it was a Crypto with no licence, or a Costa Rica one.