Mrs jd - Source of Wealth Issues

[Jacklew63]

Hi any help would be appreciated. 

I have sent numerous items to prove source of wealth but they are now asking me go back to 2016, as i spent over my income.  I have sent a bank statement and also told them i had a loan a few years later, but they still want more. I have told them all my bills and sent proof of earnings but to no joy.

If they still say i need to prove how i could afford to gamble if not they wont clear the winnings can i say i want my stakes back as they didnt ask me for proof of this before????

[cocopop3011]

43 minutes ago, Jacklew63 said:

Hi any help would be appreciated. 

I have sent numerous items to prove source of wealth but they are now asking me go back to 2016, as i spent over my income.  I have sent a bank statement and also told them i had a loan a few years later, but they still want more. I have told them all my bills and sent proof of earnings but to no joy.

If they still say i need to prove how i could afford to gamble if not they wont clear the winnings can i say i want my stakes back as they didnt ask me for proof of this before????

Hi and welcome to the forum! I've edited your title, I hope you don't mind! SOW back to 2016, Geees that is a tough one. So have you actually managed to supply the casino with the proog from 2016 and they're still not happy with how you've had the income to play or is it that you're struggling to date back that far?

[Jacklew63]

Hi i have sent them back statement from 2016 and they still not happy with that. Have told them i cannot do any more. They need confirmation i was able to gamble. Just wanted to know if they with hold payment because they think i couldnt afford to gamble..... can i get my stakes back....

[cocopop3011]

21 minutes ago, Jacklew63 said:

Hi i have sent them back statement from 2016 and they still not happy with that. Have told them i cannot do any more. They need confirmation i was able to gamble. Just wanted to know if they with Hold payment because they think i couldnt afford to gamble..... can i get my stakes back....

Can you reveal which casino is? Also can you let us know which payment they are holding? Have you just made a deposit? 

[pinnit2015]

They can’t withhold your withdrawal due to SOW; this is clear from the recent changes to the LCCP. What they should have done was pay you and then put the account on hold if that’s what they wanted. Go through the relevant section of the code and quote it.

In answer to the last question about stakes back; no

Is this SOW or RG? What exactly have they asked for it under? 

[Jacklew63]

Hi yes this was SOW when it first came about. It has been rejected on the verification side and i have had pending withdrawals for a week. Now it seems like RG from 2016.   What do i have to quote from SOW??   Can they bring in RG from 2016 also to stop payment?? Since I sent in I D and SOW last Monday, i just thought it was a couple of days max security and so yes have deposited with them since. Got email yesterday saying they needed extra statements and account is now restricted until i prove RG spending.

If they are claiming its RG would this make a difference?? 

[pinnit2015]

Don’t have the time atm to find it but in answer to RG; nope, nope nope they can never stop a withdrawal based on out the outcome of RG; they may stop you from playing there or limit you, but that’s it. 
 

No difference; I was just wondering as casinos have a habit of requesting info for SOW and using it for RG; unless it’s in their privacy policy that’s pretty much illegal

If they are withholding it based on RG then that’s ridiculous

If time I’ll try and fish something out 

They May find you to be the biggest addict once they review the docs but the money’s still yours

[pinnit2015]

Is this Casumo? 

[Jacklew63]

Yes btw. This is the response i got this afternoon. As you can see from comment no withdrawal allowed until cleared.

[pinnit2015]

I thought it was Casumo as they have a recent history of this nonsense - incidentally, they've also imposed max deposit limits of 2k for all UK customers. 

A request made by a customer to withdraw funds from their account must not result in a requirement for additional information to be supplied as a condition of withdrawal if the licensee could have reasonably requested that information earlier.

Could they have reasonably requested it before the withdrawal - er...yes, before the next deposit. Your cash was fine for the deposit that generated the withdrawal but not 2 hours later when u request a cash out? Absolute tosh. 

[pinnit2015]

Need to find the other stuff

Essentially the w/d's being held to ransom and that's something the GC's said in the past is a no no.

Also, interesting as to how this all fits into GDPR which relies on consent (they'll claim legal duty, blah blah) - you can't be freely giving consent when you're being told 'if you don't, we aint paying you' 

I'd push them to pay/complain to pending w/d and then shut the account and/or refer to to the Serious Organised Crime Unit if they've deemed you high risk for money laundering (which, by virtue of the request is effectively what they're doing)

I don't trust MGA casinos to interpret any of this rightly - Casumo are one of THE worst in this respect - they're probably scared of another 6 million fine and, given the amount of dodgy affiliates they have on the books, scared incase of a advertising fine as well. 

[pinnit2015]

Going to make a crystal ball prediction and run with Casumo will pull out of the UK

Rumours than big fine number 2 is on it's way (unconfirmed and only whispers)

[Jacklew63]

Going to go on chat and email stating i am refering to GC as to funds being held to see if its legal. But thanks

[pinnit2015]

Has your play changed? Deposits increased?

Why they’re asking stuff going back years is beyond me.

Think of it logically; at that point had they concerns they should have asked about x,y,z. They didn’t. Ergo, to retrospectively go back is lunacy.

Its been a while since I last worked with AML and it’s changed quite a bit so knowledge is a bit rusty. But I’m confident it’s the wrong interpretation of their AML duties.

[pinnit2015]

FYI I know two people they did this to and, after a bit of push back, they paid the pending withdrawals and then requested whatever they asked for. As it should be

[Jacklew63]

Have just been on chat and yes usual reply, they are awaiting a team member to review as they are not allowed. He also stated that a person can still deposit even though they ask for this. Told them i will be seeking advice tom noon. 

 

[pinnit2015]

Oh yeah I forgot to add that you’ll still be able to deposit which makes their interpretation even more ludicrous.

For future if you are depositing a lot stick with the U.K. ones as you’ll only run into SOW problems with Malta ones. 

[cocopop3011]

3 hours ago, Jacklew63 said:

Have just been on chat and yes usual reply, they are awaiting a team member to review as they are not allowed. He also stated that a person can still deposit even though they ask for this. Told them i will be seeking advice tom noon. 

 

For reference, how long have they been "waiting" for a team member to review the account? If it hasn't been that long maybe it would pay just to give it maybe another day or two first?

[Jacklew63]

Hi its been 9 days.....   is that normal???? Thought it was 72 hours max

 

[cocopop3011]

9 minutes ago, Jacklew63 said:

Hi its been 9 days.....   is that normal???? Thought it was 72 hours max

 

Oh really? I'm quite surprised that Casumo is taking that long to get back to you to be honest. That is definitely an acceptable timeframe, right @pinnit2015

[pinnit2015]

1 hour ago, cocopop3011 said:

Oh really? I'm quite surprised that Casumo is taking that long to get back to you to be honest. That is definitely an acceptable timeframe, right @pinnit2015

9 days is way too long, especially when they're holding folks' cash in the meantime.

Not unknown from them for non standard information.

They'll also probably ask you to send in your council tax bill, water bill etc - that's why i asked the OP to clarify what they were asking for all this under because, in asking for that, they're essentially doing RG checks - affordability.

Seems to be a lot on the go there - asking affiliates to stop promoting to UK - either they're cleaning house with them or they don't want anymore new UK referrals. Probably find out soon enough. 

[pinnit2015]

Bit of a caveat - there is scope for them to hold onto the cash BUT it's if they suspect you to to be laundering proceeds of crime (obviously the burden here is quite high and i imagine this would only apply if they reviewed your banking data and drew that conclusion - otherwise they'd have no reasonable basis to base this opinion on):

where it is known or suspected that the funds are the proceeds of crime, remote casino operators should submit SARs or seek a defence (appropriate consent) before refunding any of the funds

If you're at this stage getting your withdrawal is the least of your concerns as the National Crime Agency is now looking at you. 

In all other cases:

if CDD cannot be completed, then the operator must proceed in line with regulation 31(1)(c) and terminate the existing business relationship with the customer

and

if funds are to be repaid, then the amount repaid should consist of all funds owed to the customer

In other words - if they can't do, or you refuse to supply more info, or it's incomplete, terminate the account and repay. 

[pinnit2015]

I'd ask them

 - Terminate the relationship as you're not getting anything else from me

and;

Either repay me (per above)

Or send my details onto the authorities (along with my cash) 

IF they do the latter the money is held by the NCA and then, pending their review, distributed to you when they complete their work

[pinnit2015]

Note the above is AML - if they're holding on the the money for RG purposes then i can think of no valid reason for them to hold onto the cash.

Apologies for the slight caveat to the above - as stated, knowledge is a bit rusty after being out of financial services for a few years now - i thought the terminate the relation ship at that point would have been sufficient. Still doesn't sit well that you can deposit at 12pm and be fine and at 2pm need to send in the kitchen sink. 

Given that it's RG though....ask them where it says they can hold onto winnings pending RG checks  -it doesn't AFAIK. They aren't going to be slapped on the wrist for paying winnings out, they ill however be if they allow you to gambling from that point thereon. 

[Jacklew63]

I have nothing to hide concerning where i get my money from. I work 5 days a week.  The only transactions they will see is my wages going in. Bills plus deposits when i have lost/won at casino.

More loss than won .

They are asking for that period as they state the amount deposited was above my wages. But at that time i could possibly of used credit card. Of which i no longer have.