Fruity King RIPPED ME OFF !

[garrytyler]

This has totally amazed me !!

 

I joined fruity king last week and deposited £480.00 - I played this for awhile and was winning a bit and got bored so tried to withdraw - to be told needed to play through another £680 before I can withdraw. - This I get and understand as most sites have this bonus rule.

 

So carried on playing on the slots at £7.00 / per spin - lost a load and played some roulette and won a bit - so I withdrew £500, carried on playing and lost my winnings - so I cancelled the £500 withdrawal and carried on playing.

 

Lucky enough to get to £3K - so thought get out now whilst the going is good - tried to withdraw the £3K they have a 15K limit per week and £3K limit per month - fair enough not great but hey I have had a win.

 

So withdrew £1.5K - and left 1.5K in the bank, sent them all my ID docs etc and waited and waited - 5days later I get the following -

 

You are in breach of bonus terms for wagering to HIGH ?.........to HIGH ???!!!!........so they are taking all my winnings back ....LOL......WTF ??!!........if I had lost could I have asked for my losses back for wagering to high ???.

 

I encourage anyone who has lost money to this company to check what wagering limits they were using it may be you were wagering to high and in breach of terms and entitled to your money back ?

 

I am taking the matter to Gambling commission - does anyone on here have any experience of using the gambling commission ?

 

 

[cocopop3011]

Hello garrytaylor and welcome to the forum.

 

Please could you explain what you mean when you say 'wagering too high'?

 

Are you referring the bets you placed? If so then the max bet rule at this particular casino when playing with a bonus is £5, you mentioned you were placing £7 spins, this is in breach of their terms.

 

[garrytyler]

Hi,

 

This part of their terms you have shown is well hidden - if you go to their terms and conditions this is not immediately shown and you have to click through to get there - anyone checking their terms would not immediately see this - THIS IS VERY VERY important - if you just open their terms this will NOT be shown. Also if this is the case the company should put a limit on the amount you can stake - they are by having this hidden away in there terms are breaching UK Trading standards with contracts that are long winded and hard to understand. I can not access my account fully but this rule is very difficult for me to prove or disprove as my playing details are held by them.

 

My main point that I think should be highlighted is that the gambling public may not be aware of this and have lost money to this site and actually could never have won - this is the state of play they put me in - I do gamble at quite high stakes and I would love to open an online site where player do not and can not win as this has been proven.

 

I will take this as far as I can go and very interested to know if any member of this site has any experience of fighting an online casino in the courts - my first port of call will be the company itself and then the gambling commission.

 

BUT fundamentally what has happened to me should be out there for the gambling public to see - basically you think you are having a fair bet but in fact you CAN NOT win.

 

This rule also states placing a SINGLE bet - I was placing multiple bets on the roulette wheel - this is all about terminology and whilst they are holding the money it is a sad fact there is not a lot I can do.

 

If I can stop one more gambler from making a similar mistake (although I do not see any mistake) and also highlighting their low withdrawal policy and general attitude towards customers then I will feel justified.

 

As a company director my customers are key - the crazy thing is they would have probably got the money back ten fold if they had treated me fair.

[cocopop3011]

I see, well I'm sorry you feel this way and I wish you every success with your case to the commission.

 

I'd just like to add that I'd never visited the site before today after I read your thread. I found this bonus term within about 3-4 minutes from the Bonus Policy link on the home page.

 

Unfortunately casinos don't put limits on your stake, in an ideal world this would be great and the players that are caught out by the max bet rule wouldn't be. But it is every players responsibility to check all of the t&c's before playing.

 

None of us like reading these things, its tedious but it's also important.

 

But like I said I wish you luck with your complaint to the commission.

[garrytyler]

Coco pop

 

Many thanks for you comments- I have found the whole experience very sad. The one thing this really does highlight is these 2 bit companies must be stopped. As a gambler I have always paid my dues and you do expect the same I have found more and more that many are popping up and I like to try them - you only find out the bad ones when you win all the time you are losing there are not any problems.

 

I will now re-focus my attentions in trying to insure these are brought to task. I would add you have to be suspicious when they do not have a phone number to call.

 

Watch this space for an update on how I get on with my battle

 

Best regards

[Princessamidala]

I've seen so many threads about people who lost their balances due to breach of max bet rules. I'm sorry, Garry, but I don't think anything is going to happen for you. Better luck next time

[garrytyler]

I've seen so many threads about people who lost their balances due to breach of max bet rules. I'm sorry, Garry, but I don't think anything is going to happen for you. Better luck next time

[cocopop3011]

Coco pop

 

Many thanks for you comments- I have found the whole experience very sad. The one thing this really does highlight is these 2 bit companies must be stopped. As a gambler I have always paid my dues and you do expect the same I have found more and more that many are popping up and I like to try them - you only find out the bad ones when you win all the time you are losing there are not any problems.

 

I will now re-focus my attentions in trying to insure these are brought to task. I would add you have to be suspicious when they do not have a phone number to call.

 

Watch this space for an update on how I get on with my battle

 

Best regards

 

Yes please do keep us updated Gary.

[garrytyler]

Hi, you are probably right but one thing for sure is I will insure that these companies are highlighted to the widest audiences so if I can stop at least one more person being ripped off I will be happy.

 

One of my close friends works on 'watchdog' and I will look to get an investigation taken out - I may have been ripped off but I will do my dammed if anyone else will fall foul. The cost they incur setting up these sites will pale in comparison to what I have been taken for.

 

Most gamblers I know are honourable people and take losing fair and square but they do not like it when the reverse is not kept up

 

My biggest regret is the company have not had the decency to even communicate with me !

 

Watch this space for update

[ValDes]

Hello garrytyler and welcome to AskGamblers. 

 

Don't want to be the bad messenger here, but I'm afraid you don't have a valid point here. There are casino and bonus terms which you accepted upon registering at the aforementioned brand and which you must obey no matter what afterwards. Anything is irrelevant as ticking the "I read and accept terms&conditions" is your 'signature' under the 'contract' you signed with the relevant casino. Period. 

 

Now, whether these terms are presented in the most appropriate way for the casino customers is a mile long discussion and believe me, there are no two players alike when it comes to that. For that reason there are authorities called 'regulatory bodies' which issue operating licences to online casinos and make sure these operators are following their code of practice etc etc. Meaning, that if you are not happy with the way in which the aforementioned casino represented their bonus terms you should address your complaint in front of the relevant regulatory body issued the casino operating licence. 

 

I know it's painful and rather frustrating having your hard earned withdrawal declined and confiscated, however this is the reality when it comes to modern online gambling and you should either learn how to find and read these terms from now on or you will be constantly a 'victim' of such unpleasant events. 

 

By the way, I can see you submitted a case against Fruity King Casino however your complaint is about to be rejected , simply because you did not followed the quoted bonus terms above. 

[garrytyler]

Hi,

 

My valid point is as follows-

The U.K. Trading standards have outlawed complicated and difficult to understand contracts and terms. Now your reply could be they are not difficult to understand.

 

I have a copy of an online chat with the casino help line where their operator could not explain them to me..... Is there a way I can upload to this thread?

 

Now if the help line of the casino can not explain the terms or understand them how are the general public supposed to ?

 

I would also suggest that if any members have lost money to this company it could be worth them checking if they overstated as if they did they may be entitled to refund?

 

This particular company is part of a group of approx 20-30 online casinos I intend to investigate each and everyone one of them and try and bring fair order to this business.

 

If you can advise how I can upload a document to this site it will make an interesting read.

 

I would appreciate any PM's from anyone who would be prepared to be interviewed on TV or by press regarding any bad experiences

[ValDes]

Here's the relevant information concerning ProgressPlay /the owner of Fruity Kings casino/ licence with UKGC...

 

https://secure.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/gccustomweb/PublicRegister/PRAccountDetails.aspx?accountNo=39335

 

You have been explained why you don't have a valid point here, but if you still believe your rights were somehow infringed, please feel free to submit a formal complaint in front of the United Kingdom Gambling Commission which is the relevant regulatory body for the aforementioned casino brand. If they accept, process and rule in your favor, please, make sure to come back here and update this forum topic. I have some serious doubts /almost 99.99% sure to be honest/, but you never know... 

[garrytyler]

Thank Valdes appreciated- I will go that route but you state 99.9% probably won't BUT this still does not make it right and for me personally now the battle is to stop anyone else being caught like this and the FACT that some gamblers could be gambling on these sites with no chance of winning.

 

I.e if they win they will get bumbed if they lose tough. This must be stopped.

 

I feel as if £2500 has been stolen from me and in any other walk of life I would fight to then end - I may not get my money back I accept that but do you not agree that we MUST stop this kind of operation doing this to more people.

 

If I can get enough publicity via TV / papers / Facebook etc etc the quickest way to make change is when it hits the operators pockets. That is the best we can do is protect as many as possible from this happening to them.

 

Thank you again for links etc...... Is there a way to upload documents to this site? The online chat I have really does make an interesting read

[Coolivert]

The best thing to do to stop these casinos doing this or other players falling for this trap, in my opinion will be to publicize the importance of reading T&Cs and asking the casino live chats for clarification,whatever you don't understand! This is one of the appropriate things have learnt in this forum!

[cocopop3011]

Thank Valdes appreciated- I will go that route but you state 99.9% probably won't BUT this still does not make it right and for me personally now the battle is to stop anyone else being caught like this and the FACT that some gamblers could be gambling on these sites with no chance of winning.

 

I.e if they win they will get bumbed if they lose tough. This must be stopped.

 

I feel as if £2500 has been stolen from me and in any other walk of life I would fight to then end - I may not get my money back I accept that but do you not agree that we MUST stop this kind of operation doing this to more people.

 

If I can get enough publicity via TV / papers / Facebook etc etc the quickest way to make change is when it hits the operators pockets. That is the best we can do is protect as many as possible from this happening to them.

 

Thank you again for links etc...... Is there a way to upload documents to this site? The online chat I have really does make an interesting read

 

I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'stop this kind of operation'?? What operation are you referring to?

 

Most online casino will have a max bet rule in place when playing with a bonus. This information can always be found in the casinos terms and conditions which we all agree that we have read before completing registration or playing with a bonus.

 

Admittedly not all terms and conditions are that easy to read and it may take some time to find this particular information but nevertheless it will always be there.

 

I was able to find the max bet rule in the bonus terms in under 5 minutes after I read your post for this particular casino. So I am a little confused as to what operation you are referring to here?

[garrytyler]

I think this might be a terminology issue by the use of this operation. Also I am sure if you go looking for the rule you will find it in 5 minutes.

 

I would ask if you fully understand it- or more over do you think it is easy to understand? As I have stated before and a pity I can't upload the transcript the sites own operator could not explain it to me.

 

I do get the feeling that you think the casino is acting fair with this rule which is your right- my concern is that this actual rule is not clear and easy to understand and to make matters worse the casino live help operator can not explain it !!!! So what chance does Joe Average have in deciphering it?

 

Can I ask if you do think the ruling is clear and also how does a punter know when he has reached the limit and can increase their stake ?

[cocopop3011]

I think this might be a terminology issue by the use of this operation. Also I am sure if you go looking for the rule you will find it in 5 minutes.

 

I would ask if you fully understand it- or more over do you think it is easy to understand? As I have stated before and a pity I can't upload the transcript the sites own operator could not explain it to me.

 

I do get the feeling that you think the casino is acting fair with this rule which is your right- my concern is that this actual rule is not clear and easy to understand and to make matters worse the casino live help operator can not explain it !!!! So what chance does Joe Average have in deciphering it?

 

Can I ask if you do think the ruling is clear and also how does a punter know when he has reached the limit and can increase their stake ?

 

The max bet rule very rarely applies to me since I'm a low roller. It's only by chance I have a huge win or a huge balance that I can increase my bet.

 

The max bet rule is easy to understand. It basically means that when you are playing with bonus funds your bets cannot exceed a certain amount. It's a rule like I mentioned most casinos have in place.

 

This particular casino explained it as an example of an irregular game play. The fact the they mentioned you cannot place bets equal to or lower than £5 or 5% whichever is less when playing with a bonus credited to your account, makes it easy to understand for me.

 

Why the casino operator could not explain this to you I have absolutely no idea!

 

The term then goes on to explain you cannot exceed these bets until your wagering requirements have been met. A player would know this by either checking with support or some casinos offer you the facility to check your own wagering. Once this is complete, you can then raise your stake. In your particular case you mentioned you had another £680 to wager. After you completed this wagering you would have been able to make the £7 bets you mentioned without breaching the terms. But since you still had wager left to complete when you made those bets this put you in breach of the terms.

 

It's easy for me to say I understand the max bet rule, if you are a player (and I don't know if you are) that was never aware of this rule then I guess it can be confusing. I don't know what your experience in online casinos are but if you've been playing for a while, you should already be aware of this rule?

[garrytyler]

Many thanks for reply- would you agree that it would be a brilliant idea for the casino to advise on deposit what your maximum bet could be I.e if you deposited £10 and got £10 bonus you should not stake over 50p or even put a block on any bet over that?

 

This way the gambler is protected and the operator won't have any problems dealing with this issue - seems simple to me.

 

I have played online for approx 20 years and this is the first time I have come across this but generally with the bigger more reputable companies paddy power / ladbrokes / William hill etc. I have never ever had any issues with them.

[cocopop3011]

Many thanks for reply- would you agree that it would be a brilliant idea for the casino to advise on deposit what your maximum bet could be I.e if you deposited £10 and got £10 bonus you should not stake over 50p or even put a block on any bet over that?

 

This way the gambler is protected and the operator won't have any problems dealing with this issue - seems simple to me.

 

I have played online for approx 20 years and this is the first time I have come across this but generally with the bigger more reputable companies paddy power / ladbrokes / William hill etc. I have never ever had any issues with them.

 

I absolutely agree.Of course every casino should do this. That's in an ideal world. It would be great if a casino would tell us when we accept a bonus how much the max bet is, but it's just not going to happen.

 

If your campaign is to get this changed then in that case I wish you all the luck in the world. I'm pretty sure every member here would agree with you. It's a term that catches so many players out, but all I'll say is don't hold your hopes on being able to change it! 

[garrytyler]

To quote you coco- 'it's just not going to happen' I would ask why but then I think we both know the answer-

 

It's not in the casinos interests - well the ones that are not interested in building a customer base- I would suggest every reputable casino would welcome insuring customer / client clarity.

 

The best way to make change is power of the media and this is how I will tackle this.

[cocopop3011]

To quote you coco- 'it's just not going to happen' I would ask why but then I think we both know the answer-

 

It's not in the casinos interests - well the ones that are not interested in building a customer base- I would suggest every reputable casino would welcome insuring customer / client clarity.

 

The best way to make change is power of the media and this is how I will tackle this.

 

Well in that case Garry I wish you every success! 

[ValDes]

There are some online brands which added such ''controls'' or ''limitations'' within their systems and thus protecting their players from breaking max bet bonus rule incidentally or not. However, let's be honest it costs a lot of money doing that and it's definitely not each and every online casino could afford.

 

But then comes the players again who are free to choose whether they prefer to play in a casino brand which care about their customers and do anything possible to prevent them breaking some casino/bonus rule and have their casino experience ruined or not.  

[garrytyler]

Well said Valdes......

[Afi4wins]

Hi Gary!

 

If I have those transcripts of the Live Chat, I would certainly like to post it up here in the forum for others to read.

How to go about this isn't that difficult at all.

 

Firstly, you said you already have those chat transcripts. Good. Now, copy those relevant messages from the transcripts and paste them into a new Word document. Include the relevant dates and time too. Save that document in Word format.

 

Secondly, open and start a new thread (if you want to) or simply click on 'Reply' here in this thread, then copy from your Word document and paste it in here. If the transcripts are very long, I would suggest opening a new thread instead. You'd probably need to copy and paste in stages too, if it is really long, or there are many transcripts to copy and paste.

 

Give it a try, or come back for more help!

[garrytyler]

Alfie

I will give it a try later-sounds simple enough